<div dir="ltr">Robert,<br><div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On 18 June 2015 at 18:55, Robert Helling <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:helling@atdotde.de" target="_blank">helling@atdotde.de</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div style="word-wrap:break-word">Rick,<div><span class=""><br><div><blockquote type="cite"><div>On 18.06.2015, at 08:49, Rick Walsh <<a href="mailto:rickmwalsh@gmail.com" target="_blank">rickmwalsh@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div><br><div><div style="font-family:Menlo-Regular;font-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;line-height:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px">For the option ignoring transitions, what do you think of having a zero duration segment, but not including the preceding ascent segment.  That way we put the gas change at the correct depth, but indicate by a zero duration that there isn't a stop required.</div><br></div></blockquote></div><div><br></div></span>that sounds like a good idea. Just one thing: When not displaying transitions, the “duration” is not only the time of the stop but includes the time to get to that depth (so the sum of the durations add up to the runtime). So, taking that into account only displaying a zero length stop while for the duration using the time since leaving the previous stop is just equivalent to what I was suggesting ;-)</div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>The attached patch should do just that.  Please have a look.<br><br>Note:<br>-Duration is always the difference between the runtimes of adjacent rows, whether transitions are displayed or not.<br>-The 'postponed' logic is gone completely - whether or not the gas is printed now depends on whether the gas used for a segment is the same gas that was last printed.<br>-If a gas change occurs that doesn't require a deco stop, an instantaneous stop (i.e. a new table row) is created.<br></div><div>-I have added symbols to designate descent (↓), ascent (↑), level (-) or stop (x).  Something similar (but in words) could be done for verbatim output, rather than just transition, but I don't know how to deal with translations, etc.  I defined the string variable with a length of 20 with this in mind, so there's a bit of room for words.<br></div><div><br></div><div>A few example plans<br><br></div><div>60m, 15min bottom time with standard gasses<br></div><div>including transitions<br></div><div>

<table style="margin:0px" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="2"><thead>
<tr>
<td>
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px" align="center"><span style="font-weight:600">depth</span></p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px" align="center"><span style="font-weight:600">duration</span></p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px" align="center"><span style="font-weight:600">runtime</span></p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px" align="center"><span style="font-weight:600">gas</span></p></td></tr></thead>
<tbody><tr>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">↓ 60m</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">2min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">2min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px"><span style="font-weight:600;color:rgb(255,0,0)">(18/45)</span></p></td></tr>
<tr>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">- 60m</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">9min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">10min</p></td>
<td>
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px"> </p></td></tr>
<tr>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">↑ 21m</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">5min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">15min</p></td>
<td>
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px"> </p></td></tr>
<tr>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">x 21m</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">0min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">15min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px"><span style="font-weight:600;color:rgb(255,0,0)">EAN50</span></p></td></tr>
<tr>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">↑ 15m</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">1min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">15min</p></td>
<td>
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px"> </p></td></tr>
<tr>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">x 15m</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">1min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">16min</p></td>
<td>
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px"> </p></td></tr>
<tr>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">↑ 12m</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">0min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">17min</p></td>
<td>
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px"> </p></td></tr>
<tr>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">x 12m</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">1min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">18min</p></td>
<td>
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px"> </p></td></tr>
<tr>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">↑ 9m</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">0min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">18min</p></td>
<td>
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px"> </p></td></tr>
<tr>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">x 9m</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">1min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">19min</p></td>
<td>
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px"> </p></td></tr>
<tr>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">↑ 6m</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">0min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">19min</p></td>
<td>
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px"> </p></td></tr>
<tr>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">x 6m</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">5min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">24min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px"><span style="font-weight:600;color:rgb(255,0,0)">oxygen</span></p></td></tr>
<tr>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">↑ 0m</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">2min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">26min</p></td>
<td>
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px"> </p></td></tr></tbody></table><br></div><div>same dive excluding transitions<br>

<table style="margin:0px" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="2"><thead>
<tr>
<td>
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px" align="center"><span style="font-weight:600">depth</span></p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px" align="center"><span style="font-weight:600">duration</span></p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px" align="center"><span style="font-weight:600">runtime</span></p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px" align="center"><span style="font-weight:600">gas</span></p></td></tr></thead>
<tbody><tr>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">↓ 60m</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">2min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">2min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px"><span style="font-weight:600;color:rgb(255,0,0)">(18/45)</span></p></td></tr>
<tr>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">- 60m</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">9min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">10min</p></td>
<td>
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px"> </p></td></tr>
<tr>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">↑ 21m</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">5min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">15min</p></td>
<td>
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px"> </p></td></tr>
<tr>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">x 21m</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">0min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">15min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px"><span style="font-weight:600;color:rgb(255,0,0)">EAN50</span></p></td></tr>
<tr>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">x 15m</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">2min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">16min</p></td>
<td>
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px"> </p></td></tr>
<tr>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">x 12m</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">1min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">18min</p></td>
<td>
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px"> </p></td></tr>
<tr>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">x 9m</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">1min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">19min</p></td>
<td>
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px"> </p></td></tr>
<tr>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">x 6m</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">5min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">24min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px"><span style="font-weight:600;color:rgb(255,0,0)">oxygen</span></p></td></tr>
<tr>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">↑ 0m</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">2min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">26min</p></td>
<td>
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px"> </p></td></tr></tbody></table><br></div><div>A nonsensical dive that is exactly the same with or without transitions<br>

<table style="margin:0px" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="2"><thead>
<tr>
<td>
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px" align="center"><span style="font-weight:600">depth</span></p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px" align="center"><span style="font-weight:600">duration</span></p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px" align="center"><span style="font-weight:600">runtime</span></p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px" align="center"><span style="font-weight:600">gas</span></p></td></tr></thead>
<tbody><tr>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">↓ 20m</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">1min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">1min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px"><span style="font-weight:600;color:rgb(255,0,0)">air</span></p></td></tr>
<tr>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">- 20m</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">5min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">5min</p></td>
<td>
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px"> </p></td></tr>
<tr>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">- 20m</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">10min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">15min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px"><span style="font-weight:600;color:rgb(255,0,0)">EAN80</span></p></td></tr>
<tr>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">- 20m</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">5min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">20min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px"><span style="font-weight:600;color:rgb(255,0,0)">air</span></p></td></tr>
<tr>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">↑ 9m</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">1min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">21min</p></td>
<td>
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px"> </p></td></tr>
<tr>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">x 9m</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">0min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">21min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px"><span style="font-weight:600;color:rgb(255,0,0)">EAN80</span></p></td></tr>
<tr>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">↑ 0m</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">2min</p></td>
<td style="padding-left:10">
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px">24min</p></td>
<td>
<p style="margin:0px;text-indent:0px"> </p></td></tr></tbody></table><br></div><div><br><span class="">> > > In TDI training you will switch to your "low" deco gas as deep as<br>
> > > possible, usually before the first stop. We often dive with trimix, EAN40,<br>
> > > EAN80 and the switch to EAN40 will be at 80'/25m or 100'/30m (depending on<br>
> > > whether you decided on pO₂ of 1.4 or 1.6 for the deco gas). Which tends to<br>
> > > be before the first stop.<br>
> > ><br>
> ><br>
> > I don't really see why some training agencies push such a policy,<br>
> > especially if the mod is quite a bit deeper than the fist stop.<br>
> ><br>
> > We usually just switch at whatever the fist stop after the mod of the<br>
> > deco gas is. No reason to stop the whole team and do the switch.<br>
><br>
> Switch is done in transition. No stop. And the rationale is to start<br>
> breathing the higher O2 as early as possible.<br>
><br>
<br>
</span>In my view those 1-2 minutes doesn't matter. If you'd like add a minute<br>
3m / 10ft below your fist stop and do the switch there.<br>
<span class=""><br>
> > I know that some divers "on the fly" but I'd say thats a really bad<br>
> > idea. Which gas you're breathing is really important and we always<br>
> > require the other team members to verify the gas switch before starting<br>
> > to breath that gas.<br>
><br>
> Yeah, that's not part of the procedures we teach. For better or worse.<br>
><br>
</span><br>Anton, I see you'd rather wait a minute until you've ascended to the next stop, rather than switch at the MOD.  To achieve that, the switch needs to occur in the dive planner calculations rather than the notes output code.  It should then be picked up automatically by the output code.  As that method is far from universally adopted, if it is implemented I believe it should be an option rather than default behaviour.  As you pointed out, I agree that the difference in (on)/offgassing will be two fifths of bugger all.<br></div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div style="word-wrap:break-word"><span class=""><div><br></div><div>Best</div><div>Robert<br><div>
<div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Menlo;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;line-height:normal;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;word-wrap:break-word"><div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Menlo;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;line-height:normal;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;word-wrap:break-word"><div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Menlo;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;line-height:normal;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;word-wrap:break-word"><div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Menlo;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;line-height:normal;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;word-wrap:break-word"><br>-- <br>.oOo.oOo.oOo.oOo.oOo.oOo.oOo.oOo.oOo.oOo.oOo.oOo.oOo.oOo.oOo.oOo.oOo.oOo.oOo.oO<br>Robert C. Helling     Elite Master Course Theoretical and Mathematical Physics<br>                      Scientific Coordinator<br>                      Ludwig Maximilians Universitaet Muenchen, Dept. Physik<br>                      Phone: <a href="tel:%2B49%2089%202180-4523" value="+498921804523" target="_blank">+49 89 2180-4523</a>  Theresienstr. 39, rm. B339<br>                      <a href="http://www.atdotde.de" target="_blank">http://www.atdotde.de</a></div><div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Menlo;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;line-height:normal;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;word-wrap:break-word"><br></div><div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Menlo;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;line-height:normal;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;word-wrap:break-word">Enhance your privacy, use cryptography! My PGP keys have fingerprints</div><div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Menlo;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;line-height:normal;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;word-wrap:break-word">A9D1 A01D 13A5 31FA 6515  BB44 0820 367C 36BC 0C1D    and</div><div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Menlo;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;line-height:normal;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;word-wrap:break-word">DCED 37B6 251C 7861 270D  5613 95C7 9D32 9A8D 9B8F</div><div style="color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:Menlo;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;line-height:normal;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;word-wrap:break-word"><br></div></div></div><br></div><br><br>
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